Minimalism

[Beatmonkey]

John Cage, Steve Reich, Graham Fitkin. Any fans out there?

Some people claim Reich invented sampleing.

And for the clueless heres a few vids:

Steve Reich:


John Cage:



Hardly representative a limitless "genre" which has no bounds whatsoever, not even limited by human imagination but it'l give you a taste.

Ohh and I'd say 4:33 is the best peice ever written simply for the concept, (which isn't very well explained in that vid) I have a copy of the score, hows that for minamalist geekyness

[Efflux-J]

Is 4.33 the one that is just rests the whole way through?

[Beatmonkey]

That is indeed the badger.

[Conan the Librarian]

Is 4.33 the one that is just rests the whole way through?

I thought that one was entitled The Wit & Wisdom of George W Bush?

[Efflux-J]

Thats the longer title.
4.33 is a pretty cool concept. I spose you cant get much more minimal.

[willow]

fucking legends all of them!

[Eamonn]

4:33 is a fucking joke.

Pretentiousness at it's most extreme

[kerry]

4:33 is a fucking joke.

Pretentiousness at it's most extreme

I think the concept is interesting. No more pretentious than much of the Overkill's output over the weekend!

[Eamonn]

why is it interesting and why does it merit such praise?

it's only because john cage was such a respected composer that he got away with it, if a first time composer had come up with the idea and executed the "performance" for 4'33 you can guarantee that he would have been laughed at by the majority of critics who have lauded cage.

it's like modern art, any old bollocks is "art" as long as you are an artist (and recognised as one) and can attach some pseudo-intellectual meaning to your creations.

[Beatmonkey]

why is it interesting and why does it merit such praise?

it's only because john cage was such a respected composer that he got away with it, if a first time composer had come up with the idea and executed the "performance" for 4'33 you can guarantee that he would have been laughed at by the majority of critics who have lauded cage.

it's like modern art, any old bollocks is "art" as long as you are an artist (and recognised as one) and can attach some pseudo-intellectual meaning to your creations.

Have you ever sat thru it in a concert hall, I'd ask you to reserve your opinion on the matter untill you have. Its an increddibly surreal experience that gets you thinking and provokes a reaction. All the best art provokes a reaction and polatrises opinions.

[Eamonn]

i haven't sat through it, and i won't ever sit through it unless i'm paid to. human psychology often leads us to justify the time/money we invest in something that ordinarily we would not enjoy.

but what exactly does it make you think about?... the nature of music or composition? about what counts as art? personally i can & have thought about those things without influence from cage but what things does it make YOU think about?

"All the best art provokes a reaction and polatrises opinions."

Assertion, assertion, assertion. I could just as easily say that all the best art is near universally loved, it's a vague and utterly unprovable statement.

[buzzingtalk]

i saw a live performance of 4.33 and its crap until you realise what its about. not music but about noise that happens outside a musical event. im nto really a big fan of all this john cage stuff but that 4.33 is quite clever in that it made you all stop and really listen to what "silence" is

[fuzzy]

it's like modern art, any old bollocks is "art" as long as you are an artist (and recognised as one) and can attach some pseudo-intellectual meaning to your creations.

and by this statement you mean art that is classified as modern in its style, theory and content, not just art that was made in the time frame of modern day(the now/the present).
Of course you did

I agree when you say that modern art was/is about who you know, that those that leave a lasting impression are often the ones that are happy to wank off anyone with a fat pay check. But not all art in made within the modern day falls under the umbrella of modern art. In fact most art formed in the present is post-modern as artists now grow up with influences outside of the art world (cinematogrophy, photography ceramics, fashion) the acceptance and understanding of these influences makes most present day art post-modern.

It is an interesting theory though that it is only because it was Joh Cage, but then thats not unlike saying its only because its micheal angelo, or only because its squarepusher.

[Eamonn]

It is an interesting theory though that it is only because it was Joh Cage, but then thats not unlike saying its only because its micheal angelo, or only because its squarepusher.

OK, imagine if Michaelangelo - when paintng the Sistine Chapel - had decided to leave it unpainted to make people think about what it means to paint on a surface which isn't completely flat or smooth and therefore those small differences in the "canvas" affect & contribute to the artist's work. And whilst I'd bet the Pope wouldn't be too impressed, I'm sure that if you transported critics from today back then they would herald it as genius and thought provoking. However it doesn't change the fact that he has created sod-all, it's an interesting point to CONSIDER but it's a bit stating the bleedin' obvious in my eyes, and not something that one should be lavished with praise for.

Now imagine I have composed a piece that has instruments that are wildly out of tune with each other, the melodic and percussive elements are not in time and there is no apparant structure or harmony to the composition. I have put this together to show 'in extremis' the polarisation of what we think of as 'good' music, and to expose the zone between perfect harmony and chaos from which comes the sounds that the human ear and brain experience the most pleasure in.

I await the same kind of praise Cage gets with bated breath...